Bat41 vs Bat46 Les Lius, or other replacements

[Marbles]

Hey Guys,

Before I order some Bat46s.. Has anyone experienced differences between these 2 diodes?
I just built the Les Lius with Bat 41s, but must admit I'm not entirely impressed. It's the same problem I have with for instance the CB Formula 5. It's this sort of grainy overdive, that just misses something. Too grainy for a verge of breakup clean, but not full enough for overdiven sounds.
Maybe the fact it wants to be a tweed amp, and therefore I've heard it better?
The Kalamazoo does that better for me personally. But...

People keep telling me the Les Lius is awesome, so maybe it's because of Bat41 diodes? The specs are a bit different, but will they make a noticable difference? I will experiment with other diodes as well ofcourse, but if the originals sound great that would be better :)

[Beaker]

Bat46 will clip sooner (and more) than a Bat41 as it's forward voltage is around half of the Bat41.

Therefore I don't think it's going to be the solution to your problem.

Try some Russian Ge diodes (D9, D310) etc - they should clip later and sound smoother and less grainy. They seem to work really well in other Electra variants.

[Marbles]

Thanks!
Tried the D9s in place of the BATs. Seemed to be a little smoother, but could be fooled by the volume difference that is in the 3 way settings now. Still not to my liking, just miss something.

You're right though, I should just experiment. It's an easy enough platform to do so, and a way to maybe learn about myself what sounds are pleasing to me and which parts I should avoid in a setting like this.

[Beaker]

It could just be that it's a pedal that just does not play well with your guitar and amp, so always bear that in mind. I've built many pedals that are supposed to be awesome, but to me, were just dissapointing. I'll always try to mod them to get a sound I like, but sometimes they stubbornly remain, to my ears, merely ordinary.

Try different transistors as well - maybe 2N2222A might do the trick or try an MP38 just for the hell of it. Tinker with the bias resistors too. It might just get you closer to a sound you like.

Mod the crap out of it, it's just an Electra at the end of the day. Who cares if it ends up sounding nothing like the original - if you like the sound you have just "invented" a new pedal.

[rocket88]

Got to agree with beaker. Sometimes it's not just your gear, but how you use it. I have the same issue with the klon. I actually had the chance to place a real gold and silver one besides making a klone. I just don't like it. I find it lackluster and boring. I've done some mods, but still just can't get behind it.

[Beaker]

"which parts I should avoid in a setting like this."

I know what you are saying here, but treat it as a very broad generalisation, as it does not always apply.

I've built pedals using the stock components and sockets for the diodes and transistors. After listening to it, I have confidently predicted that X transistors and Y diodes would sound sooo much better. sometimes I'm right, sometimes it sounds like crap. Sometimes it sounds better going in completely the opposite direction. Sometimes the stock selection is indeed the best choice, and just occasionally all you can do is come up with a "least worst"selection.


And yeah, the Klon is definately on my "WTF is all the fuss about?" list too.

[Frank_NH]

For me, I use the Klon NOT as an overdrive but as a preamp (i.e. gain low, volume about unity gain, tone to taste).  There are much better overdrive sounds out there than the Klon.  But a Klon in front of a tube screamer is just fantastic.  Hey - maybe someone should design a pedal like that...  

[Marbles]

Thanks guys!

I'll need to harvest some 1N914 diodes for a Kalamazoo build, so I decided to go and socket everything. Maybe it's just not my thing. Tried it with a Gibson Junior, Fender Strat and a Tele. Those are my main guitars, a circuit could be better for humbuckers which is great, but just not for me I guess :)

I'm slowly getting the balls to be more adventurous when building. When I started, I really steered away from the 'use the trimpot to your liking' veros. I don't trust my liking haha. But yeah, I should socket everything and swap until I like it, instead of yet another one collecting dust in the 'maybe I'll box this one day'-bin. Maybe a different combination of parts in the Electra could make me LOVEthePEDAL ;).

I'm surprised about you guy's opinion of the Klon. It's still on my to do list, but keep putting it off. This is not helping haha. Gotta do it one day though, if only just to see for myself. It's such a ridiculous hype. Even if it's that good.

[Neil mcNasty]

Have you tried ditching the diodes and just leave them out of the circuit?

I've been in the same situation as you many times, and it took me quite a while to figure out that I hardly ever like hard diode clipping.
It just sounds crap in my ears, as I find that they greatly reduce the dynamic response of a pedal, and often introduces a harsh or nasal/ugly distortion, mostly suitable for Metal
(which is totally wrong for my style of music, even though I'm an old Punk/Metal head)

My experience: Remove them, and the circuit suddenly comes to life and starts to breathe and respond to my picking dynamics.

It might also be an idea to add a "diode lift" pot to reduce the harshness and compression introduced by the diodes, so that you can tune it to a sweet spot of your liking.
Or add a small resistor (try a 1K) between the diodes and ground to reduce the clipping/compression intensity...
This will also raise the overall volume of your pedal...

I also have to agree about the statements about the Klon:
As a clean boost/toneshaper at low gain settings it sounds really great.
Crank up the gain and use it as an overdrive, and it becomes a piece of shit!
The most overhyped pedal ever!
...and notice the fact that you hardly ever see one on a pedalboard that has the gain cranked up high.