Great Jumpin Germaniums! (Ge Diode and Transistor Reviews & Discussion)

[Beaker]

Lee Oswald wrote

Would someone mind providing links to some of
these Russian sources.

Yes eBay is the place to search - there are a bunch of sellers, most of them in Russia, Ukraine, Bulgaria and Romania. I've yet to read anything that would suggest that any of them are unreliable, and many are outstandingly good to deal with.

A couple more that I have used, and would happily use again:

http://stores.ebay.co.uk/valtek-2005?_trksid=p2047675.l2563

http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/lci_electronics/m.html?item=311078117163&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEWNX%3AIT&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2562

http://stores.ebay.co.uk/ELECMENTS13?_trksid=p2047675.l2563

[IvIark]

I refuse to buy from ELECMENTS13. I tried to buy two different types of diode from him not so long ago, and on the auctions it said that additional items were a much lower cost for shipping (can't remember what it was at the time).  So I ordered the two types and sent him an invoice request to which responded that he didn't offer discounts.  So I directed him to the note under the postage section for each saying additional items were priced at x amount, and he said that was only if you ordered the same type of diode.   I asked him if that was justified by a difference in weight between two different D9x diodes and told him to just cancel the auctions as I wasn't going to pay extra, which he did, and now I wouldn't buy anything off him.

I don't like sellers who try to charge you more for a nonsense reason they seem to make up as they go along.  And I wouldn't care but 5 minutes after he refunded me he changed many of the auctions which dropped the normal shipping price down much lower than I would have paid him even with the combined postage.  So he really shot himself in the foot there.

[rocket88]

i've dealt with almost all of the ones mentioned and never had a problem with them either. here are some others i've used.

http://www.ebay.com/sch/elecments13/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_ipg=&_from=

http://stores.ebay.com/elena8913/

http://stores.ebay.com/electronpv/

http://www.ebay.com/sch/ml-electronics/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_ipg=&_from=

http://www.ebay.com/sch/pulsar8882/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_ipg=&_from=

i've ordered a ton from elena, and even asked them to look for certain parts, which they did. when i order a lot i send them a list i'm looking for and the amounts, and they send back a total, usually they will even give me more of a discount.

our bulgarian friend is also fantastic for transitors, i usually order 100 at a time so i get a brand new, unopened box and get to open a 30+ year old box of transistors, its silly, but i know there are others that love that too.

i know i'm missing a few others, but i have to check again. but since i order from the same guys, a lot of times they'll change the price or throw in a lot of other stuff because they remember, which is awesome.

[Beaker]

I just want to report back on the D311 diodes I got yesterday.

First up, I can't compare them to D310's as I don't have any , but compared to D9's they sound  more "in your face" to me - not quite as much bass content, with a "tighter" more compressed sound. They sound more silicon-ish if you like.

I reckon these would be a better match for higher gain pedals, saving the D9's for low gain overdrive (or underdrive) use.

They are freakin' huge though! They look like a pair of Hunter - Killer submarines in dry dock sitting on your board. Mojo factor turned up to 11...

[rocket88]

hahaha. the D310's look the same, but i just think they look like little nuclear containers. the D310's sound compressed, big, fat, and dark, but still have a bit of a bit to them. i could be wrong, so i'm going to test them along with Si and Ge diodes, as when i first tested them it was with other Ge diodes.

great add to the thread. i might have to pick up some of those D311's so i can give them a shot. thanks buddy.

[glasspak73]

I bought a lot of 50 MP13B russian pnp germanium.do you have any info on these transistors? im about half way through testing my box and they are averageing 25hfe to 35hfe.I hope im doing the testing right.i just subtract the value of step 1 from the value of step 2 right?

[IvIark]

The datasheet shows the minimum gain as 20 so your numbers look realistic to me.  Not too sure what something that low will be useful in other than germanium buffers or used as diodes.  I'd consider building a few Ge buffers and selling them on TGP to make the money back you paid for the transistors.

[glasspak73]

I'm not botherd about the money i paid for the transistors i just chaulk it up to a learning experience,but the  odd thing is i bought OC81-D's and AC 128's and all of these are rangeing the exact same. is this possible? or maybe i'm doing something wrong in my testing?I built the vero tester on here with the 5k trimmer and have been checking this trimmer between each transistor test, sometimes the trimmer value changes slightly so i have to readjust.Im going to try to find the right resistor.I only have 5% the closest i have is a 2.2k.

[rocket88]

i think something you're doing is wrong, cause that seems really odd to me. i personally don't use the tester, as i bought a DCA55, which not only measures the leakage, but gives you the hfe with the leakage accounted for. the only advice i can give you on the testing procedure is read this, if you haven't already. the tester on the site is build around being able to use this method, as describe by R.G. Keen.

[glasspak73]

I have read it,I been testing according to the 3 steps on this site.i built the tester from here first with trimmer then measured out a couple resistors to get 2.472k,take first reading the second reading,then subtract first reading from second to get hfe.is this right? Also what is the point of finding out the leakage of each transistor? Am i supose to factor that into the equation? I will buy a DCA55 just to make sure.Thank you so much for your help.I am learning alot on this site but looks like i have a longer way to go yet.One other question thats been bothering me,i am useing 5% carbon film resistors.Would i get a better sounding circuit if i used 1% metal film resistors?I know that the 1% metal film are more accurate but does this make a circuit like distortion/fuzz/OD sound better?

[IvIark]

Some people think that the constituent material in a resistor can affect the sound, and I am quite open to the possibility of things like that because I do think there can be subtle differences with some caps for instance. and more obvious differences in diodes and transistors beyond their most commonly compared characteristic like gain and forward voltage.  These things are inherently imperfect so I don't really buy into either side of the argument whole heartedly and prefer to just see things as I find them through my own building experience and using my own ears.  But with resistors I've never noticed anything which would make me choose one type over another when the value is identical.  You can make fantastic effects with all of them.

I have a lot of all the common types of resistors we use, metal film, carbon film and carbon comp and am happy to use any in my builds.  One thing I will say is that you could use a 10% carbon comp and when compared to 1% metal film with everything else being equal (in terms of the other components) you can hear differences, but I would say those differences are due to the compounded tolerances and not material.  

And this is where I DO (sort of) buy into the argument for different types.  If you make two identical pedals, one with 1% metal film and one with carbon comp then it may be that the 10% tolerance and drifted values of the carbon comps simply gets your build in a sweet spot in terms of bias and filters which sounds better.  It may not be for mojo carbon reasons but who cares, it's the results that are important.  Of course the reverse may be true and the drifted values may take you away from a sweet spot you found with the metal film build, but either way having a wider variety of values due to tolerance and drifting does at least give you some scope to experiment beyond the often perceived "strict" values used in the schematics and layouts.  And I quite like that unknown quantity, especially as I'm someone who builds for myself and so am not aiming in the slightest for consistency or repeatability like you would if you were producing commercially in quantity.

The only time I would religiously use one type of resistor before another would be for something that needed more precision like maybe a crucial voltage divider where you really wanted to hit a certain value, or maybe a very close value required for the control of an IC which I needed to be exact, and then I would always use metal film.  For looks, it's carbon comp every time

At the end of the day I've heard a lot of people over the years say that transistors of the same gain, diodes of the same forward voltage and all ICs sound the same too, so I've learnt to largely ignore what other people think and use my own ears to decide what is or isn't important to me.  After all, there's no one else I'm ever trying to please with my builds other than me

[Heath]

I'll be getting more involved in this as I am able.  I built an Electra box for testing diodes and will be building some sort of simple germanium fuzz box for transistor testing since I finally have a modest assortment of each.

BIG reason for posting right now, however, is in regards to www.3pdt.com.  First of all, they were pretty quick in sending my order out and everything is there.  Pretty nice Small Stone PCB, haven't populated it yet, but the goods look good.

I ordered a 5 transistor (100-150hfe) pack and a 5 transistor (150-200hfe) pack.  The 100-150 hfe pack yielded 5 germanium 3AX31C transistors from about 90-120 hfe.  Not bad.  The 150-200 hfe pack, however, yielded 5 germanium 3AX31C transistors from about 60-90 hfe.  Leakages were all pretty darn low, though.

They weren't terribly expensive, but MAN did that 150-200 pack SUCK for what it was labeled as.

They have some cool stuff, but BUYER BEWARE on those germanium transistors.


===================
===================
===================


On a completely unrelated note:  I just got my Bulgarian diodes in:



Nabbed 100 of the D9E diodes and about 40 of the D310 yadernyye bomby

Славься, Отечество наше свободное,
Дружбы народов надёжный оплот!

[Surgeon]

"
i haven't had good luck with GT308's either, it's the 1T308's that i've had great luck with. they're the military version, and seem to have higher gains and are more consistent the the normal GT308's. "

See, I checked again and it's 50 1t308s that I have and yet I haven't managed to get them to play nicely...I might not hane found the appropriate circuit but that only reinforces my disdain for the unpecdictability/unreliability of germs...

[rocket88]

hey surgeon, i've used them in fuzzfaces no problem. but the one thing i do is i make the bias pot either a trimmer so i can adjust it to where i want it, or in my fuzzfaces i make an external bias. what i've found is i seem to prefer them with higher then normal voltage, like between 5-6V. i feel like that's part of magic in them, is that you have to adjust the circuit to get the most out of them, its not just plug and play like Si.

but, yea, Ge transistors are unreliable. i have some that should be 50-100hfe, but the majority test 40-50hfe. it's just the nature of the beast.

[Silver Blues]

So, since I now own about 70 of them and will very likely own many, many more in the near future, anyone know anything about the sound of 1N69A diodes?

[Neil mcNasty]

I have bought alot of noce stuff from this seller: bg2014-manue (sorry, can't find an url link via my annoying iphone ebay app)
Be aware that the beautiful girl on the profile picture is his daughter, who set up the profile, but daddy took it over instead of creating his own.
Anyway:
He's got alot of nice transistors and diodes + a bunch of other nice stuff as well.
The transistors that I have measured so far has both nice gain and low leakage, and are very consistent.
But most of all I have to mention that he was very happy to hear that I was stocking up for pedal production, and not buing them in order to put them back on ebay with a triple pricetag, just necause you include the word fuzz to it...
He wanted me to notify the DIY crowd, that he will not run out of MP13/20/38/39's and 9D(x) diodes anytime soon. He also told me that he has an insane amount of capacitors that he has not looked trough and posted on ebay yet.
To compensate for the postage costs after combining my orders, we agreed that he would include some samples of some other stuff that might be interesting for me...
I could not believe my own eyes when I opened up the package. There was an increadable amount of extra stuff in there, amongst them a wide selection of MKT/Film/Tantilum and very small size Electrolytic Caps (meaning: physicaly small, not small values), that we will probably see posted on ebay very soon...
Not just great products, but also a very nice and posetive person to deal with. Highly recomended!

[Silver Blues]

Good to hear. I've been planning on buying some of the D9 diodes for a bit now.

[rocket88]

can't agree more McNasty. i bought a bunch of sfd-112 diodes from him, and some 1d507a's and he ended up adding a bunch of extra stuff for me too, mostly other diodes i've been wanting to try, in addition to caps, and an assortment of Ge transistors. super nice guy, with great prices, if you want a larger assortment of things, or looking for something in particular just message him and he'll give you an amazing price. he usually watches this forum, so i usually just tell him that i'm from here, cause he likes knowing that we like dealing with him and happy with his services. i actually have some things i want to get from him, and was about to message him about them, mostly some of those long legged trimmers, and lm308 tin cans cause i'm really curious if it will add mojo to my bass rat.

also, a massive plus for me is i usually get my orders from him in about a week, which is faster then i've gotten packages from sellers in the US. also, don't forget that he has 2 other names on ebay that he uses, they're all posted in a thread somewhere here.

[dbat69]

I totally agree, the best seller I have come across on eBay by far.  Friendly, helpful and generous.  As already said, lots of nice things, and great prices.
The other account he has is : ml_electric

There is another account, pulsar8882 which is his, but it is operated by someone else independently, so it is very difficult for him to combine items from bg2014_manu and ml_electric with items from pulsar8882 - just something to keep in mind when you go on a buying spree.

Ahh, rocket it must have been you that asked about those trimmers, I mentioned it to him recently that there were people still after them, and posted that he had re-listed them.

[rocket88]

Probably. Lol. I know he's looking out for those tesla trimmers he had under the old account, cause I'm kicking myself for not buying them when I had a chance last year.