adding a sub-switch to a fuzz pedal

[BassVD]

Dear colleagues

A friend of mine asked me to build him a Hyperion fuzz, but he'd like to have a footswitchable octave down or some kind of sub-switch, "like in the old Ashdown amps," he said. Now, if I remember correctly, in the Ashdown amps with such a switch, it were the subharmonics that were boosted, so it was not really an octave down. Now I was wondering if it's possible to add some thing like that to a Hyperion, and how?

The MXR Sub Machine also came to mind: a fuzz with a footswitchable octave down. But I couldn't find any schematic or vero layout for a decent and/or small octave down circuit.

Any help would be much appreciated!

[nocentelli]

Joe Davisson's Shocktave does a reasonable monophonic octave down for not (that) many parts, and there's even a layout here -

http://tagboardeffects.blogspot.co.uk/2014/02/joe-davisson-shocktave.html

I'd put it before the fuzz but on a separate bypass switch since it's a nice effect on it's own.

[BassVD]

Of course, I forgot about the Shocktave, that one might do the trick! Thanks for bringing that one back to my mind. :)

Still curious though for a subharmonics booster like in the Ashdown amps. There is this Ashdown/Dr Green Octa Dose pedal that seems to simulate the circuit from the amps, but can't find any schematic or even gut shots.
I've also been looking into pedals such as the DOD Meatbox and Bifet, Mantic Effects makes clones of those two: the Density Hulk and the Thug. I could only find the vero layout for the bifet, so nothing for the other ones. And I'm a bit dubious about the bifet if it would be a good match to add to the fuzz in order to achieve a "sub blast".

In my opinion, a (maybe simplified) sub booster might be a cool add-on for different kinds of pedals.

[Sphere80]

 This  won't  give you an octave lower, but when the company changed hands, I read the newer version replaced the 100n coupling caps with 220n for a little more low.

On my Hyperion, I added a switch to turn it into the Ruiner bass fuzz.   It totally changed the character.

[BassVD]

No need to change the character of the Hyperion, he really wants to boost the subs, "to create sonic mayhem". He's going to use the pedal on bass. I figured that's a useful piece of info, as I subs aren't that effective on guitar.

I suggested the octave down to him, and he said that that would be okay if I really, really couldn't get to boost the subharmonics. So I'm still looking into that. But as far as I know, that will be more difficult than the sub octave.

I'm hoping that one of you guys can still come up with something for the subs.

[BassVD]

When looking at the site map for schematics, I came across two things that might be a solution for the above problem. But I've got a few questions about them:

The Dan Armstrong Yellow Humper: http://tagboardeffects.blogspot.be/2013/01/dan-armstrong-yellow-humper.html

The Yellow Humper is a low end booster. It might be good enough, yet it is no subharmonics booster.
If I want to add this one to the Hyperion fuzz, should I put it before or after the fuzz to achieve a sub boost?

I also saw the 2 band Gyrator EQ: http://tagboardeffects.blogspot.be/2014/05/4-band-gyrator-eq.html

That one is more tweakable to boost certain frequencies. But what frequencies should I ideally boost for that sub thing my friend wants/needs? And again, should I put it before or after the fuzz? Remember, it'll be footswitchable.

[gul]

It's not DIY, but wouldn't a Meatbox do the trick? I wonder if there's a DIY project out there like the Meatbox.

[BassVD]

Yeah, like I said, the Meatbox would probably be the best, but the guy wants it all in one box.
And I couldn't find a DIY project like the Meatbox anywhere. The Meatbox seems like a one of its kind though...

[BassVD]

Just bumpin' this topic: anyone has any more ideas?

An octave down is a possibility, but it isn't really a sub booster as described above.

And I just found out that the Shocktave also houses a fuzz. And that's something I don't need as I already would be pairing it up with a fuzz (Hyperion). Is there a decent tracking octaver with only an octave down? Again, it will only be used on bass.

Any thoughts on the idea with the Gyrator EQ or the Yellow Humper?

[Sergio]

For the subs enhancement, me as a bassplayer recording with a Daw i use to go the vst eq way and cutting what you dont need helps a lot, so using a high pass, yes, cutting lows its great to help being heard the ones you want to be heard, a hardware diy like this could be great for that
http://tagboardeffects.blogspot.com.es/2015/01/hpf-technology-hpf-pre-2.html

Playing live you have to be aware of the equipment you re playing through, but for me having thunderous bass, means cutting the bass that its barely heard, 40hz and below, so the rest of bass frequencies can shine

And if you are looking for octave down, stripboard, i d go for this one,
http://vulcanofx.blogspot.com.es/2014/09/chopped-boss-oc-2.html#comment-form

But i have to tell you i havent tried this, i bought madbeans lowrider and i am so happy with that one, to me it sounds much better than youtube demos ive heard from that one, it goes from normal octave to great roarr or almost hammond organ, and sounds great both on bass and my guitar.

[BassVD]

Thanks for the input!

The chopped OC-2 might also be something cool! I like my OC-2, but I don't know whether my friend would like it.

One question though: why would a high pass filter give me that sub boost? I mean, it cuts the bass/lets the treble pass? So I would lose the subharmonics? Pretty weird to achieve a sub enhancement that way, or am I not thinking this through?
I would need a low pass filter of some kind, no?

[Sergio]

In my experience boosting below 30 hz has had no benefits, when i try boosting 20 hz it sounds worse, i have more low presence and punch cutting as I said, but it is a simple experiment, an equaliser, could be from laptop or hardware, some beers and start researching what works and what not!-)

[BassVD]

Thanks for the input! :-)

I discussed it with the guy and he opted for the DOD FX10/410 Bifet Boost. Now as he is mainly interested in getting the lows boosted and the pedal also can boost highs, is there a way to alter the schematic to have even more lows boosted?

http://tagboardeffects.blogspot.be/2013/10/dod-studio-bifet-preamp-410.html

[BassVD]

And I'm going to incorporate a toggle switch to change the order of the fuzz and bifet boost.
I guess I could use a 3pdt toggle switch, like this?



Or am I missing something?

[BassVD]

Aaaand he also requested to add a Hummingbird at the end, so that'll be a 3-in-1 box.
Will I run into problems when all 3 circuits run off the same supply? Can I just send 9V from the same jack to the three pedals, or will this inevitably give me buzz or something?

That's three questions in less than an hour. Sorry guys!

[nocentelli]

The 410 could be modified, but it would involve a fair amount of reworking (e.g. to modify it to have a bass control in  addition to the treble cut/boost), so much so it would probably be easier to find a different circuit. You could just try increasing the input cap value, but I'm not sure how much this would increase the sub-bass. You might find it just overdrives the opamp.

The diagram you posted will work fine for an order switcher: If you use a 4PDT, you can use the fourth pole to switch a bicolour LED to indicate the order.

You can combine as many circuits as you can physically fit in one enclosure: Using a single DC jack, just run separate power (+9v) and ground wires to each effect board. My only concern is that the Hummingbird is notorious for ticking: It is possible that this may cause ticking in the other two circuits even when the Hummingbird is not engaged. Separate power filtering on each circuit will go some way to minimising this.

[KT]

http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=101580.0

same chip as used in the meatbox. M51134 on ebay was a bit expensive but ok. On aliexpres they are cheaper I found out later. I will try this hopefully soon.

[Beaker]

Hummingbird alert!!!

PLEASE read Nocentelli's post above about the Hummingbird, and take on board what he has said!

Hummingbirds will tick - there is nothing you can do about it, just try to minimise it to an acceptable level. I too think that boxing a Hummingbird in a multi pedal unit could lead to problems with the ticking bleeding through to the other pedals.

As long as you are aware of this and expect it to happen then that's ok. As he says, you may need to do some careful signal isolation and filtering work to get a result you can live with.

Sub boosting is fraught with problems - mostly gear related - if your amp and cab can't handle those frequencies you will get almost no discernable effect. If they can handle them but not reproduce them accurately, all you get is mud and rumble.